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  #11  
Alt 12.03.2018, 20:32
Merete Smith Merete Smith ist offline
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In Denmark it is possible to see entries in churchbooks online as go for the census back from 1787. Some even from the 16th century.
Is that possible in Germany?

And by the way - I am so grateful for your help, let me know if you have Danish ancestors. Maybe i can help...
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  #12  
Alt 12.03.2018, 20:35
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Hi

Read my answer #5 in this thread, there I have written all details form the POW lists.

P2409 Paris le 20 mars 1915: hôpital temporaire au lycée Mont de Marsan 31-12
P5990 de Bordeaux, à Lyon le 13.09.1915, en vue d'échange (he was first at Bordeaux, then was exchanged via Lyon)
P6351 de Rochefort, en vue de rapatrier 01.09.1915 (stamp 29.11.1915) (he was first at Rochefort, then was repatriated)

I think the hôpital temporaire was in the lycée Victor Duruy at Mont-de-Marsan as you can read in its history:
http://lyceeduruy.fr/lycee-duruy/historique-lycee/

Regards
Svenja
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Geändert von Svenja (12.03.2018 um 20:38 Uhr)
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  #13  
Alt 12.03.2018, 21:02
Kasstor Kasstor ist offline männlich
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Thank you Kasstor. Can i be sure it is the right person? Is Hellwege a common name?

Regards
Merete
The combination Rudolf Wilhelm Heinrich is the key and the age (55) . Hellwege appears in the Neuhaus area, for instance here http://www.denkmalprojekt.org/dkm_de...d/osten_ns.htm a WW I victim in Adendorf. But not in Kiel, as I wrote before.
Until the mid thirties ( from 1919 ) German death documents did not show much info, but a document from 1939 should show a living or deceased wife and the parents of the person deceased. In case of divorce there would probably be no info on a former wife.

Regards,

Thomas
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FN Pein (Quickborn vor 1830), FN Hinsch (Poppenbüttel, Schenefeld), FN Holle (Hamburg, Lüchow?), FN Ludwig/Niesel (Frankenstein/Habelschwerdt) FN Tönnies (Meelva bei Karuse-Estland, später Hamburg), FN Lindloff (Altona, Lüneburg, Uelzen)
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  #14  
Alt 13.03.2018, 12:07
Merete Smith Merete Smith ist offline
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Hi

Read my answer #5 in this thread, there I have written all details form the POW lists.

P2409 Paris le 20 mars 1915: hôpital temporaire au lycée Mont de Marsan 31-12
P5990 de Bordeaux, à Lyon le 13.09.1915, en vue d'échange (he was first at Bordeaux, then was exchanged via Lyon)
P6351 de Rochefort, en vue de rapatrier 01.09.1915 (stamp 29.11.1915) (he was first at Rochefort, then was repatriated)

I think the hôpital temporaire was in the lycée Victor Duruy at Mont-de-Marsan as you can read in its history:
http://lyceeduruy.fr/lycee-duruy/historique-lycee/

Regards
Svenja
Please forgive me, if i ask stupid questions. I am so grateful for your help. I have never before worked with war material, which is a huge task, i do not speak either German or French, and with Google Translation you very often get a very odd translation. So i might make slow progress...
At the moment i go forth and back between the links you and others have given me. Everytime i have to get it translated - also when use the seach engine.
Am i right if i assume that he was wounded in Lycee Mont de Marcan, then he went to Bordeaux via Lyon, and then he was sent back home to Germany via Lyon? Then he lived in Germany untill 1939 when he died.
Thats his history in short terms. Since he's my Granddad i want to find out if he still was married and if my dad has any other (half) siblings. I do not mind about the cost, but i do not know how to do it. Do i have to travel to Germany to an archive or can i order the papers via the Internet? Do i need to fill any special forms, like in Denmark, when you ask for personal papers?

Once again thank you very much!
Merete
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  #15  
Alt 13.03.2018, 12:23
Merete Smith Merete Smith ist offline
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The combination Rudolf Wilhelm Heinrich is the key and the age (55) . Hellwege appears in the Neuhaus area, for instance here http://www.denkmalprojekt.org/dkm_de...d/osten_ns.htm a WW I victim in Adendorf. But not in Kiel, as I wrote before.
Until the mid thirties ( from 1919 ) German death documents did not show much info, but a document from 1939 should show a living or deceased wife and the parents of the person deceased. In case of divorce there would probably be no info on a former wife.

Regards,

Thomas
Dear Thomas, thank you very much!
I have tried to use the link you gave me. Got more than 600 hits, i must be doing something wrong. Feel so stupid...
How do i get a death certificate? Where do i apply? Do i have to go there? Since it is such an old case, maybe special applications will not be needed?
Sorry for all my questions, but the goal seems nearer than ever before!

Best wishes
Merete
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  #16  
Alt 13.03.2018, 12:34
Kasstor Kasstor ist offline männlich
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Hi Merete,

I just made a phone call to the Stadtarchiv in Kiel. You can order a copy of the death document in English with the following data " Standesamt III, Sterberegister, 1939, No 1329, Hellwege, Rudolf Wilhelm Heinrich"
The copy will be sent either by snail- or e-mail.
Fee would be € 7,40 + postage ( or not)
e-mail address britta.thiel(at)kiel.de

Regards,

Thomas
__________________
FN Pein (Quickborn vor 1830), FN Hinsch (Poppenbüttel, Schenefeld), FN Holle (Hamburg, Lüchow?), FN Ludwig/Niesel (Frankenstein/Habelschwerdt) FN Tönnies (Meelva bei Karuse-Estland, später Hamburg), FN Lindloff (Altona, Lüneburg, Uelzen)

Geändert von Kasstor (13.03.2018 um 16:21 Uhr)
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  #17  
Alt 13.03.2018, 16:05
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Am I right if i assume that he was wounded in Lycee Mont de Marcan, then he went to Bordeaux via Lyon, and then he was sent back home to Germany via Lyon? Then he lived in Germany untill 1939 when he died.
No, he was wounded when he was in the war, we don't know exactly where. Then he got captured (06.09.1914) by French soldiers and was transported to a Lazarett/War hospital. At some time he was transported to the temporary hospital in a grammar school at Mont-de-Marsan (Les Landes). Later he was in a prisoner of war camp at Rochefort and then he was at Bordeaux. When he was repatriated he travelled via Lyon (as every other German soldier who was repatriated). I can translate the important information about the regiment/division and the text about the temporary hospital at Mont-de-Marsan (existed since 13.09.1914) and also the information about the prisoner of war camps in Rochefort and Bordeaux.

Regards
Svenja
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Geändert von Svenja (13.03.2018 um 17:37 Uhr)
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  #18  
Alt 13.03.2018, 18:40
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Hi Merete

The Infantry Regiment Nr. 84 belonged to the 18th Infantry Division, which was in the theatre of war as follows:

04.08.1914 - 16.08.1914: Eroberung von Lüttich
13.08.1914: Einnahme des Forts Pontisse
18.08.1914 - 19.08.1914: Schlacht an der Gette
23.08.1914 - 24.08.1914: Schlacht bei Mons
26.08.1914: Gefecht bei Genly
02.09.1914 - 03.09.1914: Gefecht bei Château-Thierry
04.09.1914: Gefechte bei Viells-Maisons-Montmirail
05.09.1914 - 09.09.1914: Schlacht am Ourcq
06.09.1914 - 07.09.1914: Monteaux-Esternay
12.09.1914 - 12.10.1915: Kämpfe an der Aisne

http://genwiki.genealogy.net/18._Division_(Alte_Armee)

So maybe Rudolf Hellwege was wounded and got captured at Ourcq or Monteaux-Esternay.


The hospital in Mont-de-Marsan was a hospital for wounded German prisoners of war from 13.09.1914 until February 1915, then it was a hospital for wounded French soldiers. On 13.09.1914 they expected 500 wounded German prisoners of war, they were accomodated in the boarding school. On 14.09.1919 arrived another 160 wounded German prisoners of war, they were accomodated in the classrooms. As there was not enough place inside the buildings and as the weather was beautiful, some were installed outside under the trees. Civil and military doctors arrived and looked after the wounded German soldiers. The meals came from the kitchen of the military barracks. In February 1915 the wounded German prisoners of war were transfered to the hospital in Blaye or on the Ile de Ré.

http://lyceeduruy.fr/lycee-duruy/historique-lycee/

Regards
Svenja
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Geändert von Svenja (13.03.2018 um 19:11 Uhr)
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  #19  
Alt 13.03.2018, 19:29
Merete Smith Merete Smith ist offline
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Oh what a great job all of you are doing! I hope that i one day can help you! Thank you - thank you!

I will ask for the death certificate for Rudolph Hellwege from The Stadtarchive.

And Svenja - now i understand. It must have been a tough job to participate in the jobs for Reg. 84. It is going to take me quite some time to read through all that stuff.

Now - there's a picture from Reg. 84 on one of the links you've sent me, Svenja. The very first one, i believe. It stays in the left corner.
Though I have no idea how Hellwege looked like, there's a man who look exactly like my dad. I guess it is too good to be true, and that my fantasy is running wild, but still...

Perhaps you want the story:
Rudolf Hellwege stayed at Haderslev Kaserne in 1911. In Haderslev he met Anna Elfriede, she was 17. Soon she became pregnant, but they did not became married. In december 1911 my dad, Friedrich was born. Annas parents took care of the child. Anna herself worked and went to Altona where she met another man whom she married. Then came the war. Annas and her new husband, Hermann, got a little girl - Erna. Hermann died in the war in 1915, he drowned. Annas little girl, Erna, died in 1918. During the war my dad was sent to an orphants home in Jutland. Since he was German, it was not a pleasant stay. He grew up in orphants home, since Anna kind of lost her mind. Despite of that, he was the best daddy one could ever want, he died in 1974.
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  #20  
Alt 13.03.2018, 19:43
Merete Smith Merete Smith ist offline
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Hi Merete,

I just made a phone call to the Stadtarchiv in Kiel. You can order a copy of the death document in English with the following data " Standesamt III, Sterberegister, 1939, No 1329, Hellwege, Rudolf Wilhelm Heinrich"
The copy will be sent either by snail- or e-mail.
Fee would be € 7,40 + postage ( or not)
e-mail address britta.thiel(at)kiel.de

Regards,

Thomas
Dear Thomas

I have now applied for the document via the e-mail address you have written. Thank you. Do not hesitate if i can help you, one day!

Best wishes
Merete
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