Searching for the Freienhagen family

[Freienhagen]

Hi. My name is Robert. I'm building a family tree of my family. Unfortunately, I encountered a problem and I can not go deeper because there are no record books.because there are no record books. Karol Freyenhagen is my most distant ancestor which in 1879 at his son's wedding is dead.The only starting point is a family story telling about it that one of the ancestors escaped from his father went to the US for profit and was murdered on the way back in the vicinity of the towns of Rypin Brodnica in East Prussia (today's Poland) by his drivers. There was a trial and the driver was caught.According to the message, they were a noble stateI would ask for help in finding people involved in this story. Thank you in advance for your help


Robert

[Xtine]

Hello Robert,


welcome at ahnenforschung.net.

What was the name of Karol Freyenhagens son? Where was his marriage?
Can you show us a scan of the marriage certificate of his son?

Do you know the name of his (Karol's) wife?

Please let us know the details of his family you already know.

[Freienhagen]

Hi Xtine

Thank you for the warm welcome

The son's name was Jan Karol Hugo Frejnhagen -The surname in each subsequent document sounds a little different
The marriage took place in the village " Przyrowa" but Jan was born in village "Jedwabnie" both in Easten Prussia
His wife is Natalia Jelwic/Elwic (Karol's wife)
I do not know what else I could say if something is not clear, ask

For clarity I do not know if Karol and the person from the story who escaped from the Father is the same person

Jan got married at the age of 28

[Posamentierer]

Hello Freienhagen,

your Jan Karol Hugo Frejnhagen was born at noon on April 25th, 1851
and baptized in Jedwabno on June 9th, 1851 (Lutheran) as
Johann Carl Hugo Freyenhagen (please note the „y“).

His father, Carl Freyenhagen was a Gastwirth (innkeeper),
his mother, Natalie née Elwitz, both living in Jedwabno.

Godparents were:
Ferdinand Gerwin, Christoph Reich, Dorothea Podehl, Gustav Julius et[and] Philippine Elwitz, Caroline Boczek.

I sent you a pn.


Good luck, searching!

[Freienhagen]

Hi

Posamentierer you are amazing

How did you get this data
I do not know if you know but for 2 years I was in the same place, not to mention that lately I even rented a detective so that he would search the record books for me from the given town for me in Poland but he found nothing.If it was possible to go back one more generation and get to know the data of Carl Freyenhagen's ancestors, it would be wonderful.This would allow me to confirm or refute my family history. That means a lot to me.

I forgot to mention at the beginning why one of my ancestors went to the USA and why this whole History happened. Well, he made misalliance.He wanted to marry his own servant, so he ran away from home and said that in the US he would earn a fortune that his father had because he knew that his parents would not agree to this marriage.

Robert

[AKocur]

Hi Robert,

How did you get this data

It's online on ancestry.


Here is some more data (purposely leaving the orthography of the names as on the documents):

The marriage of Carl Freynhagen and Natalie Elwitz was in Jedwabno on october 29th, 1850. No parents are named in the field for permission by the parents to marry. His parents aren't alive anymore, her father possibly also. Carl's age is listed as 30 years, Natalie was 26, both from Jedwabno (living, not necessarily born).

More of their children:

• Ludwig Emil Ferdinand Freyenhagen, b. 2 apr 1853, bapt. 24. apr 1853, d. 30. dec 1853 → at his birth, the father‘s name is listed as Carl Wilhelm Ferdinand Freyenhagen
• Franz Julius Richard Freinhagen, b. 26 march 1858, bapt. 3. apr 1858, d. 7 feb 1862
• Theodor Herrmann Ewald Freynhagen, b. 21 dec 1860, bapt. 26. dec 1860

Let me know if you'd like the documents. Carl's profession isn't always called "Wirth" but I couldn't make it out myself.

Greetings,
Antje

[TükkersMitÜ]

Hello,

maybe it's important to notice that a "Wirth" in Eastern Prussia was not an innkeeper, he was a farmer.

Sorry, just saw that it really says "Gastwirth" in the original documents, thats indeed an innkeeper

The marriage of Carl Freynhagen and Natalie Elwitz was in Jedwabno on october 29th, 1850.

In the "Aufgebot" there is also a town mentioned which is called Heselicht. Maybe one of them was born there?

There is the death record of a woman called Philippine Elwitz in Jedwabno which lists as one of the deceased's children a Natalie. Philippine Elwitz born Pikatz was a "Obercontrolleurs-Witwe" and died on September 8 1872 in Jedwabno. She was 81 years old. Her children are: Emma, Julius (?), Nathalie, Laura, Gustav, Ewald, Emilie, Ludowika, Mathilde and Emil, all grown up. There are weddings of some of her children in Jedwabno.

However, the family seems to originate from somewhere else, which is indicated by the fact that Johann Elwitz, Obercontrolleur, and his wife Philippine Pikatz baptised children in at least two different parishes. They were living in Fürstenwalde und Mierunsken.

Regards, Annika

[DoroJapan]

Hello,

Fürstenwalde:

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/F%C3%BCrstenwalde

"Fürstenwalde, Kreis Ortelsburg, Ostpreußen: Księży Lasek, Dorf im Powiat Szczycieński, Woiwodschaft Ermland-Masuren, Polen"

Should be the right one - distance Księży Lasek to Jedwabno: 42-45 km

cheers
Doro

[Freienhagen]

Hi
AKocur If it could be, I would be very grateful because I do not have access to Ancestry.com

Robert

[Posamentierer]

Hello Robert,

it's such a pleasure, to help you over this hurdle!

Here is another clue: as Antje AKocur noticed, when Ludwig Emil Ferdinand was baptized, his father's complete name was given as Carl Wilhelm Ferdinand Freyenhagen. When Carl and Natalie married, he was 30 years old. Here is a baptism for a Carl Wilhelm Ferdinand Freyenhagen, born January, 8th 1820 in Cammin (today probably Kamień Pomorski in Poland), baptised on January, 10th. His father was Johann Friedrich Freyenhagen, a coxswain. His mother Henriette Cochey. There is no other or better match for the complete name on Ancestry.

Even so Cammin is more than 300 miles away from Jedwabno, I would keep this family in mind, when looking for your ancestors.

Have a nice weekend!

[AKocur]

Hi Robert,

I sent you a PN.

About that Cammin Carl Wilhelm Ferdinand Freyenhagen; his parents Johann Friedrich Freynhagen and his mother Charlotte Henriette Eliesabeth Cochoÿ married in Cammin on may 6th, 1814. In 1835 she gets remarried as widow in Gramenz to a Johann Friedrich Henning.
So at least the father is dead by 1850, but I haven't found any death reports of either parent yet. Nevertheless, this family is a good candidate if we can find other links to corroborate the theory.

Greetings,
Antje

[Freienhagen]

Hi

First of all, I would like to thank everyone for their commitment

I must admit that I am surprised by the latest results
I did not know that this family story, if true, took place so long ago
And as for new facts. I am surprised that Carl met his wife who lived so far away from him. In those days, people rather marry people who live up to 20-25km from them.With history, it would be consistent to get married again.But for that he would need his death certificate (from what I know, if he was murdered, then there would be some annotation).At the end, Johann Friedrich Freynhagen had to be the one who emigrated to the US because the US did not exist before

Generally, it was often in Germany that a few names were given to children ?

I did not find anything in Castel Garden

Robert

[Posamentierer]

Sorry Robert, but I don't get your last posting.

Did you think that children in Germany were given only 1-2 first names - or that their names were oftentimes the same? Both depends on the area and period of time. But most of them probably had 1 to 3 names. And yes, Annas, Marias, Johanns and the likes were very common.

I too, don't get your remark on "Castel Garden".

Please note that the Cammin connection is simply a possibility. None of us is certain, Carl Freyenhagen of Cammin is your ancestor.

To elaborate I'd like to repeat Annikas or TükkersMitÜ's remark on the village of Heselicht, where the public announcement of Carl's and Natalie's wedding has been made (as has been in Jedwabno). One of the couple probably lived in Heselicht (Łubianka, Powiat toruński, Województwo kujawsko-pomorskie, Poland) or had even been born there. Probably it was Carl, who was from Heselicht: here are my thoughts:

Annika found the Jedwabno death entry for Philippine Elwitz, who died in 1872 at the age of 81. One of her children was a Natalie (Elwitz). In a village of roughly 500 inhabitants there should be only one family with the names Elwitz and Natalie. So Philippine and her children were probably from Jedwabno. Hence Carl could have come from Heselicht - in my view this were much more likely than the Cammin origin I myself came up with.

Don't give up!

[Freienhagen]

Hi

Answering the question kalex1946 I do not have anyone who knew German so I rely on the translator. That is why searching in the German language area is quite troublesome for me. My only hints are the events from the story which I told of course, except for the genealogy tree extended thanks to you.

Of course, Natalie (Elwitz) comes from Jedwabno because her family still lives in this village, at least that's what the detective claimed. Sory I tell it right now,it is caused by my little genealogy experience, it seemed obvious to me.

Worth mentioning in this story is that the servant with whom my ancestor married worked for him as an outgoing. She came to work for them

From Jedwabno to Łubianka it is 176 km

I think maybe it's a town Heseelicht -Leszcz distance 60 km or Heseelicht -Dresden

Robert

[AKocur]

I am surprised that Carl met his wife who lived so far away from him. In those days, people rather marry people who live up to 20-25km from them.

In general, that's true, but there were always some people who, for different reasons, ended up much further from home than 25km. For example, I have an ancestor who in the 1820s got married about 200km from his birth town; another one migrated about 300km in the 1870s.
In Carl and Natalie's marriage document, they're both said to be from Jedwabno, so Carl probably first moved there, then met Natalie while living there.

As for your family legend; it might be true, it might not. We simply don't know yet. Legends have this thing about evolving throughout time, so they often have a true core somewhere, but aren't necessarily true as a complete story. Like maybe it wasn't a direct ancestor of yours, or someone only planned to go to the US and ended up somewhere else instead. The only way to find out for sure is figuring out the lives of your ancestors

Greetings,
Antje